I was at a friends house tonight playing Rock Band 2-- *cough* expert drums *cough*. These were work friends-- and I'm not 'out' to my work friends / colleagues. It's not really their business, and I don't really feel the need. However, I don't really care if they know or not. The only person I am actually concerned about is my mom-- she would freak. None the less, somehow a conversation started where one of my friends was describing how his cube-mate was sent a video link that pretended to be a music video to a song, but turned out to be raunchy gay sex. He was describing how 'funny' it was-- because it was so disgusting :-S
And then he said "I can't even stand two guys kissing; it's just disgusting-- it makes me sick". I didn't really know what to say. I suppose I should have reacted in some way, but didn't. I'm not usually always silent in these situations, but I was this time. One of my other friend's wife, who I think suspects I am gay, chimed in to say "I don't have a problem with homosexuality or anything -- but I don't want to see _anyone's_ porn".
Now my friend is a really nice, smart person, who I don't think would ever wish ill-will or inequalities on anyone. But he was a product of a very religious household in the southern U.S. And I would venture to guess that many of these households have the "oh, theres nothing wrong with it as long as I don't ever have to see it, deal with it, or think about it" mentality. They preface everything with "I don't have a problem with gays, but..." and then they spout off something that is ridiculously offensive--- even though they think they have 'made it ok' by claiming their 'tolerance'.
I'm not really offended by what my friend said-- I wish it weren't the case, but in 2009, in the southern U.S. two guys kissing is 'pornography' to many people. I just don't know if I should have reacted in some way. Maybe I should be more aggressive in actually trying to help the situation. Does my silence make me complicit to his discrimination? Maybe coming out and showing my work friends that "gay people are real people too" would help the situation....
What have you guys done in similar situations? Are you always outspoken? Are you always silent?
Much Love,
Steve
12 comments:
either silent or say it doesn't bother me at all, but not outspoken.
i don't think you're 'betraying' anything/anyone in a situation like this. you should respond according to the level of exposure you have/desire. if you were out to these people, you could afford to be a more outspoken if you wanted to, but that's not a compelling reason to be out.
imo
torchy!
ps. couldn't see the pics in the reader - glad i viewed the blog page :P
I ditto torchy, and add this caveat: Are these friends so close that they wouldn't use the information to advance their careers? I suspect not. Never underestimate the venality of other people when money, advancement or inter-office disputes are involved.
i probably would have stayed silent too. dont worry about that
word verification: jiser
lol
I think you can only do what you feel comfortable with, there are bigger issues at play for you here. It's weird but through blogs I am really starting to understand that in Northern Europe there is a more liberal annd tolerant society than maybe you experience there, it wasn't always the case, so things do change you see.
All the best
Nick XX
Your choice what you do.
I would have kept silent too but that' b/c I wouldn't know what to say and can end up saying the wrong thing.
Maybe or maybe not. I mean if they are the type of people that would make working with them difficult then I say don't come out to them.
But if you think that you can handle it then come out
Like I said it's your choice what you do
You know, I haven't been in such a situation *years.* I think I relate to and hang with a different circle of people.
Yes, I know it's Texas. There's steers and queers, and all that. But the pack I run with typically is pretty open.
Now that most of my friends and coworkers here know about my tendencies to kiss men, people may say something like "that's gay" or "that sucked balls" and I'll just call 'em out on it, e.g. "Yeah, it feels pretty good..." It's disarming, funny, and also still corrects their "bad" actions.
Silence isn't a betrayal. I did that for years, but in the months leading up to coming out, I started to speak out a bit more whenever people said stupid things.
I agree with Torchy and the lot. But to ease you conscience you might chime in next time that you don't have a problem with it either. That wouldn't out you, but would let them know that you don't agree with their attitude.
Steve
i am out to some but not all the people where i work but i do think one does know. i don't think you should fault yourself for being silent. As you said this is your business and not anyone else's. Be comfortable with yourself first and each situation is different so just go with your gut feeling. As for me there really is only a couple of guys that i am comfortable around and they don't have a problem with gays but i am normally silent when the religous nuts start talking. you really can't deal with these people. they think they are right and everyone else is wrong.
strange coming from a christian isn't it.
willy
I had a very interesting conversation with an openly gay guy one time, me being in the closet.
He described to me a situation where a bunch of straights were talking about how hot this girl was...and he said something along the lines of" but what about guys"...thus making it very awkward for everybody.
I argued that saying that would hardly do anything to form a more inclusive society. Then he said,
"What can we do to create a more inclusive society other than to simply speak up?"
I was speechless.
I would have stayed silent in such a situation. Of course, Im in the closet, so that has to do with it. If I were out, I might have said something.
However, it is hard to speak up. It has really hard to go up to someone who just voiced his opinion that people like yourself are "disgusting" and tell him that he is wrong. It will almost always lead to rejection, and nobody wants that.
Realizing that this post was written over 3 months ago, but I am just now discovering your blog.
(Thanks, Mr. HCI)
I guess my situation is similar but different since most of the comments I hear come from students. I teach 6th graders, and they are certainly not known for their tact in discussion.
If a student makes a derogatory comment toward someone or something I will take the time to correct them. I teach acceptance for all in this world. Given that I teach about the ancient cultures, we are always discussing inequalities and discrimination through the years. I always link it back to today's issues (racism, sexual orientation, hate crimes, religious persecution, etc.)
While I choose to teach my students acceptance and will speak up about their inappropriate comments, I choose not to disclose portions of my personal life (for example, who I date) to them.
--------------------------------
In contrast, when members of my family make comments that I find derogatory, I tend to remain silent. Most of my family doesn't know yet. For example, there were some comments made in jest around the dinner table a few months ago when we all gathered together. Granted they were telling a joke, but it was offensive to me and did hurt on some level. I didn't make any comment or show any sign of expression to the joke. I simply chose to move past it. I was not ready to be out to my family at that time, so remaining silent was the choice I made.
I suppose the point I am trying to make here is that there are times when I choose to speak up and other times I choose to remain silent.
When we are ready to take a stand it will happen. It is all about what is best for you in the moment. Let no one dictate your actions. You know you best.
@JC
Thanks so much for the comment! I don't get many, so I treasure any and all I get. It is truly appreciated :-)
I agree-- I just hope that the time will come when I can be honest with my mother and not destroy our relationship. I know exactly how she will react-- I know her *very* well. And even though a part of her knows already, to be confronted by it will crush her, and she will become an emotional wreck. So yes-- I am picking and choosing my times to stand up...just not with her. Jeez...all of this agony and nonsense for something normal. It will be nice in hundreds of years (thousands?) when civilization has evolved past all of this and we don't need to 'come out' of anything.
Thanks,
Steve
Post a Comment